DJ: Luke, you mentioned the point about moral and political principles being at stake here. Now in business, people are generally a bit dismissive about airy-fairy talk about morality and that kind of thing. But surely in this area it's absolutely crucial, in the sense that, if governments and police and so on start to say "maybe it's better if we don't publish controversial books, or do controversial research in universities, because it's going to upset people", then it actually impinges on the market. If you can't sell the books you want to sell, then that's bad for Borders, and if Huntingdon Life Sciences can't do research then that's bad for the whole pharmaceutical industry, and for the progress of medicine. So do you think this is an interesting area where more abstract talk about defending civilisation, defending our values, actually has a very concrete application; it's very important to defend things like the rule of law, and freedom of speech, simply because you can't function in a capitalist free society without those things.

LJ: Clearly you're right that capitalism works in free markets where the rule of law applies, but of course that's theoretical. The brutal reality, as Michael said, is that for a lot of businesses faced with, say, kidnapping, it's easier to take out an insurance policy and have the insurance firm pay if there's a claim. Those higher premiums get transmitted through the market, and it's probably easier to go along with a low-profile attitude, because that way there won't be any adverse consequences with staff, suppliers etc. and they will take the view that "we were unlucky this time but it will be someone else's turn next, if we can get out of this hole, it's not our problem."